UMW - Sathiya Sam - Ep xxx4
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[00:00:00] Hey, hey, what's up, everybody? It's the Sam here. Welcome to unleash the man within. Thank you so much for listening. I hope you're having a fabulous day. We got some really good stuff up ahead here. I got coached on with me. We're going to answer some listener questions on the back end. We're having a lot of fun doing that.
Um, but, uh, before I jump into any of that, I do want to make sure that you guys are getting resources as well as possible. So obviously this podcast is free. You The book, The Last Relapse is also for free. We also just have a myriad of other [00:01:00] resources, uh, that we are providing kind of on a rotation. And one of the ways that you guys can get access to that is through our mailing list.
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And so if that's you and you want to fill your feet with a little bit more positive material that might actually help you instead of tempt you, uh, make sure you follow our accounts at the, uh, me, Sam. The link is in the show notes. Let's jump into today's content. Uh, you know, um, somebody actually wrote us in and asked us to talk about this and we love the idea so much.
We agreed to it. Uh, but basically the premise is that singleness is not discussed enough in the church and marriage is often over glorified. Sean, what do you think? Do you think that's a fair assessment? Do you think maybe we don't talk about singleness [00:02:00] enough in the church? Yeah, I feel pretty like ill equipped on how to talk about it effectively other than we can glean from Paul's, uh, writings about, you know, it's better to be like me and.
I think the, the angst is kind of, and I think you had a guy on the podcast, like the singleness message in the church has often led to a lot of abuse. So there's a lot of different angles of like, how can we do it healthily? This is what we're seeing. We see marriages like, you know, there's marriage conferences and marriage nights and marriage, everything.
And everything's about marriage. So, man, I really feel for us young, single Christians today, especially as they get into the thirties, it's almost like they become this like leper. It's really scary. Yeah. Yeah, the one thing I think good coaches do, like I think new coaches, whether again, whether this is true of fitness, finance, porn addiction, marriage, like whatever, I think early coaches will try to get people to survive difficult periods, you know?
So it's like, Hey, we're making some changes to your diet [00:03:00] going to be pretty difficult for a while, but if you can tough it out X, Y, Z, I think that's like what novice coaches do. I think more advanced coaches actually, they, they try to limit. The amount of times that their clients are in survival mode at all.
So it's not like, Hey, you just have to get through this. It's how do we make the most of this season, even though it might have its challenges and we, you and I definitely know that like coaching people through porn addiction, it's not like, Oh, I just need to get through, you know, my four months with you and then life is going to be good.
It's like, No, no, no. Like we're going to teach you to thrive right now, even before you're free. Um, and then freedom will just naturally occur as you follow our system and go through the process. But when people are in survival mode, they don't do very good things. You know, they, they make poor decisions.
Um, and then number two is once they exit that season, uh, they don't even know how to enjoy it. You know, and we see this in the church with people in singleness and sex in particular, right? It's like, don't have sex before marriage survive singleness. And then you'll get [00:04:00] married one day and you'll be able to have all the sex you want and it's going to be awesome.
And it's like, what kind of crappy messaging is that? Like, these, these poor singles are number one, they're trying to survive singleness instead of seeing it for the incredible season that it is that you own. By the way, you don't get to be single when you're married. So like you, you only get that season once you got to make the most of it.
But number two is then we like we hear so many stories of dysfunctional sex lives in Christian homes because they don't have healthy views around sex and they spent their times in singleness white knuckling it. Instead of building their identity, learning how to foster intimacy, even understanding their sexuality better and their sexual stories.
And then they go into marriage and they're just totally dysfunctional. And so they've been sold a lie. And then now it's like, man, the expectations were sky high and they're knee high instead, like realities, like not meeting it at all. And it creates all kinds of dissonance spiritually and relationally and everything else.
So I think. [00:05:00] I really feel it. You know, if you're listening to this podcast and you're single, um, this, this episode is for you today. Cause we really want to make sure that we're helping you and hopefully reversing some of these wrongs that have been done. Yeah. Yeah. I think that's coming to my mind and I don't have like a ton of great experiences that come from it, but when I was actually in, I know I've mentioned it before on the podcast and the Amway business for seven years, one of the things that they constantly.
Helps remind young single people of, cause that's, you know, the young vulnerable people they lure into the business is like, you know, grow yourself, like attract the person. That you, you know, you are going to mutually want to be with one day, like, you know, grow and become the kind of person that is attractive.
Like get to some sort of, and this is probably where I would disagree that I get to a certain level in the business before you even think about dating. And, you know, obviously that messaging is kind of like in porn recovery. A lot of people don't get married until you're free. I think those are harmful messages as well.
But there was a delayed [00:06:00] gratification that I did learn that was really, really helpful. And it was built around this idea of growing to attract the other person rather than trying to find the other person. Like it's this man hunt, or I guess woman hunt. It's so true. Like the. Yeah, yeah, I agree. I just single being single.
Those were some of the best years of my life and now I would say being married. These have been some of the best years of my life. But truthfully, I loved being single and I always felt more miserable when I put pressure on myself to get married or to be with someone. You know, I went to 80 weddings. I went to honestly, I stopped counting after 80, but I went to 80 weddings, not just like not gigs, like 80 weddings of people that I was on the invite list, friends, family, but mostly friends, uh, before I went to my own wedding, you know, and you can't, you just can't keep feeling bad for yourself that you're not the person at the altar [00:07:00] after, you know, wedding 45, you know, at some point you have to realize like, Hey, this is a, this is awesome.
I'm so happy for my friends. Um, and I'm going to do the stuff that I can only do right now, you know, so for me that was traveling, that was recording music and they're all things that I can do when I'm married, but I just got to do them on my terms without having to, you know, um, accommodate somebody else's needs or desires.
And there's, there's something really cool about that. And, uh, and I do agree. Um, I remember, uh, like with what you're saying, Sean, cause I, I remember I had a. Was it a pastor? Maybe it was a speaker in ministry school. I forget, but I had somebody who told the story. Basically, this guy came to them. He said, man, I just can't, I like, I'm just having a hard time meeting women.
And he was like, I can get women, but like not actually the kind of girl that I want to be with. And the pastor was like, well, what kind of girl do you want to be with? And he's like, well, you know, I want her to love the Lord. And ideally I'd want her to be a little bit educated. She has to have amazing character.
Obviously, I want her to be, you know, beautiful. I want to have some physical attraction. And he started listing all these things. [00:08:00] And the pastor said, are, are you, are you good enough for that person? And he was like, Uh, I think so. And he's like, Oh, well, aren't you still going to the clubs on the weekends?
And he's like, well, yeah, I mean, I love going to clubs and hang out with my friends. And he's like, well, do you think that woman's looking for a guy who goes to the clubs on the weekends? You know, like you just started connecting the dots a little bit. Um, and so I think that's a, that's a huge part of it is like, I guess I think these are the two messages, right?
One is, Enjoy singleness because it's a rare season and you only get it once, especially as a young adult. You know, those years are so fun. But secondly is if you do want to get married, don't worry about finding that person. Worry about becoming the person that that person wants to be with. And I, I think that will, that will cover most of the issues.
I was, I was single between relationships for eight years. Like I said, I, I definitely had moments where I thought, man, I wish I was with someone and why isn't it happening for me? For the most part, I really enjoyed [00:09:00] singlehood and I'm so grateful. I did, you know, quit pornography and it wasn't really about quitting pornography as much as it was about personal development.
Like it was becoming the person God made me to be, you know, and, and stepping more into my potential. And those things set me up so that when I did meet Shaloma, it wasn't, I didn't feel like I had to go. Get my life in order and get my ducks in a row. So that could be good enough for her. It felt like, man, we're well matched and we're on similar journeys.
And this is really cool. And I think, yes, God does that like in, in God's way, but we also play our part in our development and everything else. I think it goes a long way. Yeah. Yeah. I've said this on record before, probably on my own podcast, but I think if people really look at singleness as a beautiful thing, we would have better marriages and less marriages.
And it's interesting, right? So many people are on online dating, forcing God's hand, creating relationships that I don't, you got to argue to God intend for that to happen, or did you make it happen? [00:10:00] Right? Like it's such an interesting argument and we have so many people just on the hunt to find somebody that can just, you know, basically tolerate them if they're not growing.
So one of the things that I would say about my own journey is I met Helena when I was 25. 2020, maybe 23 and a half, 24. I'm old enough not to say 23 and a half. I had done like being, being in the Amway business, like I got it in at 18. I literally slept like four hours a night until I, like in that season of like 18 to 24 meeting Helena.
Reading leadership books, personally developing, working on myself. The problem is, is there's always this pressure to perform in businesses like that. So it just fed my addiction, but I was developing my character and all of these other things that actually laid a foundation for what I do today in my coaching and who I am today.
So it's easy to look at the age and say, Oh, I'm 28 and I'm still single. It's like, you know, Sean, you met Helena at 24. Like you're lucky. It's like, you know, Dude, I put in [00:11:00] hundreds and hundreds and hundreds and thousands of hours of not sleeping and reading books and listening to podcasts and taking notes.
And literally I would literally drive from Vancouver to Seattle after work to get around like successful people and get home at six in the morning the next day and go right to work. Like I was like, that's the problem with these businesses. You get brainwashed and you're like become the zealot, but it did something to me where I was growing myself.
And it's like, how many hours have you put into developing yourself? That would be the question. It's not about age or, or how old, you know, how old or young you are. It's about. How many hours have you put into these things? There is the 10, 000 hour rule, man. Like you want to go anywhere, do something about it.
Yeah, it's so true and funny. You and I have been talking even not in these sessions, just when we're meeting and whatnot, but you know, I'm, I'm doing a lot of work right now to reverse some of the, the damaging health effects from the season of building this business. Cause I really did push myself and, you know, just long days and nights and shutting the laptop, you're going straight to bed, you know, all this kind of stuff.
[00:12:00] Um, But I feel the same way, which is that I wouldn't do it again unless I had to, but I also wouldn't trade it for the world because the way I grew and developed, like, I just, I couldn't get that any other way. And I mean, I'm 33 years old, like, I got plenty of time to recover from a busy season like that.
Like, I'm not too worried about that. Um, the seasons happen, but I do think that sometimes we get really narrow sighted. Um, for people who are single, uh, there's a, we've talked a little bit about some things that you can do. So we've talked about making the most of it. We've talked about the personal development, the character development and doing that.
Um, I would also say there's a couple of things you shouldn't do. So one thing is I'm not, I don't know how you feel about the Sean. I'm not a huge fan of the list. I don't know if you've ever heard about this. There's like the list of like, write down everything that you want and watch God fulfill the list.
Here's why I'm not a fan of it. So I actually love the idea of let's invite God in. Let's let's cure God's thoughts. Like, who does God want you to be with and what's he saying? I love all that. [00:13:00] Um, we, my wife and I, Did this with our house even. And it's the exact same principle, which is that rather than just having the list and saying, this is everything we want in a house, or this is everything we want in a spouse, uh, I sound like a doctor.
um, , do you want it in a house? Do you want it in a spouse ? Um, what, what you, what you actually want to do or what we found to be really helpful. is to have two categories. What are non negotiables and what are bonuses? And the non negotiables are the things that allow you to decide if you would even consider being with someone.
The bonuses are not deal breakers, but they're things that, Hey, this would be awesome to have. And at the bare minimum, you will likely get a couple of your bonuses anyway. Um, and maybe, maybe God will just help you hit the jackpot and you'll get everything on your list. But I find that the, sometimes single people get caught up in their head.
Like they overcomplicate it cause they're like, Oh, this person's amazing, but there's this one thing, you know, and this, this one thing wasn't on my list or, you know, it's not [00:14:00] always about the list, but they can just become very picky and they end up staying single longer. Um, and I think, I think that'd be my one encouragement is have the non negotiables, let that be the Dick, uh, what dictates whether or not it's a, it's a deal breaker or not.
Um, and then, you know, uh, have some fun with it. Like my wife, uh, my wife, when I asked her out, she was terrified and she hadn't, she hadn't been on a date in a long time. She was just going through stuff and in a different season and, um, all I, I just asked her out for coffee. So it was like barely a date, you know, but she, it's still like really triggered a lot of her, you know, Uncertainties about dating and when she was praying about it, she was trying to talk herself down after she said yes, not talk yourself out of it, but she was trying to talk herself down because she was like, ah, what did I do?
And the Holy Spirit told her, uh, Shaloma, it's just coffee. You know, it's just coffee. And so that'd be my one encouragement. You know, unless you're in a season where it's like, I just don't feel like I can handle it. Maybe you're going through some stuff or whatever. Uh, that'd be my other thing is like, don't get [00:15:00] too, don't get too caught up in like the, you know, it's, it's gotta be exactly like this, or I have my list, um, have the non negotiables for sure.
Like for me, it was, You know, it's about faith. It was, uh, having to, um, it was about dreaming big and having vision and purpose in life and some of those things, those are all very important. But, um, there was a lot of things that were bonuses and, you know, some of them are there, some of them aren't, and it's totally fine.
Yeah. Yeah. I really love that. The, the list idea that you're talking about, I think, I think we've talked about that before. I really love it. The only time I would ever do like a list with somebody is like, Write down all the things you think you want and then become that person. Like you, like you kind of talked about with that pastor.
I've done that with a few guys before. It's very impactful. And that's actually cool. Most of those guys are actually married or, or engaged today. So it's a small few, but it's, it's been very helpful when you look at it from that perspective. You know another another interesting part of this is like the Idolization of marriage and I was just [00:16:00] reading that scripture in first Corinthians that you were talking about the other day where Paul It's just it's a fascinating scripture because Paul is basically saying man.
I wish you guys could all be single You know, like my, my heart is solely devoted to Jesus. I am not entangled in any romance. I don't have any kind of split. Like, I wish that all of you guys could be single. And it's funny because you would think that Paul would say, but obviously, We have to procreate, you know, obviously God has designed, you know, he made Adam and Eve in the garden.
We know his design, but actually what he says is, but you know, if you're gonna, if you're gonna burn with lust and you can't help yourself, then I guess you should get married. You know what I mean? It's like, it's like, dang, bro, like, what are you talking about? Like, we have to procreate. Like, there's other parts to this.
Um, but I would say, um, I, I don't, I don't think there's ever, um, it's never appropriate to idolize anything, obviously. But I would say that I, I do believe marriage is. Uh, really special to the heart of God. [00:17:00] And if it does feel like your pastors or your peers have idolized marriage, um, it's a hard thing to explain until you've experienced it.
But the, the only way I can really frame it, and this was actually very helpful for me when I was single, And I was going to all these weddings and I had to realize I could go to a wedding and say, Oh man, you know, another wedding, poor old me, like I said, I didn't really fall into that a lot, but there, there was some of it, but the reframe that happened probably, you know, at my, my whatever 20th wedding somewhere along the way was how often do I get to watch two friends make a covenant with each other, like, like God takes covenant really seriously.
And there's something really sacred about it. And, you know, it's unfortunate that our society does not view. Marriage as a covenant relationship between another person and God the way it's supposed to but we as believers obviously do And I think that's what makes marriage so special And so if it does feel like man, they they're they're just idolizing it.
[00:18:00] It's like this. Holy grail It's definitely not about having sex and it's not even about marriage itself. It's the fact that it's, I mean, I don't, I don't know if I'll ever make another covenant in my life. I probably won't, you know, certainly not to the same effect. Uh, there's something really special about making a covenant, um, with another person and with God.
It's so unique. It's so sacred. And so I would just encourage you, like, even if there are people who are in your, in your ear a bit and they're kind of annoying about, Oh, you should get married. And hey, have you checked out so and so, you know, like we've all gone through that when we're single. It is a little bit annoying.
Uh, just understand that there is something really special about making that covenant. And if you can sow seeds and honor the people who are married and say, man, what a beautiful covenant. Or when you go to a wedding, you know, saying like, man, what a great opportunity to watch a friend of mine. Make a covenant with the person that they love.
You know, I think if you can have that heart posture, it really sets you up well for when that time does come for you. And you get to make a covenant of your own. Yeah, it's beautiful. I think there's a, an element where [00:19:00] God doesn't need you to heal your trauma, to find your wife. I'm a great example of that.
He doesn't need you to, to be anything. He can do anything with anyone. It's really important to consider that. But, if you are finding, like, Taking risks to talk to women is scary, or you're already going into a place of last. Like, there's, there's lots to explore there that I'd really want you to consider because, you know, when guys are single, and they haven't really looked at their mother wound, and they're intimidated to talk to girls, or they already, like, start thinking about what would it be like to date her before they even say hi.
It's like, That's a problem, bro. Like clearly you haven't done any of the work that singleness actually gives you the time to work on. So it's really important to think about that. Cause when I met Helena, I like we're at the library, she's sitting across from me. She, she actually looked quite young. So I was just like, Oh, like she's looking at her camera.
I asked her if her camera was expensive. Like that was my opening line. I said, is that an expensive camera? And then she was [00:20:00] like, Oh, you have an accent. That's really cool. Where are you from? Oh, I've never met anywhere from the Czech Republic. Started talking about like hockey and travel. And it was just so cool.
So natural. I had no intentions. Even the whole time we ended up spending like four hours together because she ended up going for a walk and invited me. And it was like, Didn't really feel romantic at all. Like I thought she was younger. I thought she was just like a nice person. I thought I'd show her around Vancouver and just be a nice person.
Like, can you get to that level so that you take more risks to say hi to women so that you can actually meet your future wife? Yeah, that's a huge part of it. I, so I was that guy who was like, I was so scared to ever put myself out there. And I was, you know, I would say I was just. I was just like attractive enough as a general guy that I would always have some female interest.
You know what I mean? I wasn't like, I didn't have girls lining up for me, but there was always somebody interested. And admittedly, like I was a bit of a coward about it because they was always like, yeah, there is this person I'm actually really [00:21:00] interested in. But if I pursue them, I risk being rejected.
Whereas so and so is interested in me. So I think I'll just spend my time entertaining this instead. Um, and that, I mean, that number one led to a really destructive relationship early in university that, you know, devastated me and hurt me really badly. And then I was single for many years cause I was sort of starting to figure that out.
And Shaloma was the second. Second or third person that I like felt brave enough to be like, Hey, do you want to grab a coffee? Um, and yeah, it, by the time I got to Shaloma, to be honest, it was like, I was actually excited about it. Cause I, I had, I had already reached that place where it was like, you know what?
Even if she says no, I'm going to be okay. Like I know that I'm a good, I'm a good person. It doesn't reflect on me and it just wasn't in the cards, you know, I had reached that place. So I love that. I think you're right. Um, those are good litmus tests. And it's not to say like, look, if you have nerves about it, if it makes you feel scared, that's normal, it's what we're talking about is confronting [00:22:00] the fears, right?
And having the courage to overcome, um, yeah, it can go a really long way. Yeah. Yeah. And I think overall, just, just a ton of compassion for people that are single with the messages they're getting about the, idolization of marriage and we don't even see good marriages in the church consistently. So it just doesn't make any sense.
Like it really is confusing to the mind. And then, you know, there's, there's, there's wounding from mother wounds. There's wounding from past relationships that play into all of this. So just a ton of compassion. That was a huge fear of my fear of rejection, fear of looking stupid, like fear of being a bad kisser.
And kiss my first girl said I was like 17 and I, you know, it just feels so embarrassing. You look back, you're like, who cares? Like, what does that even mean? Right? We put so much emphasis on so much stuff. So I think my, my main message to the, you know, particularly the guys listening, you know, have some compassion for your story.
And realize that there could be a time where you have a line in the sand where you really [00:23:00] catch a vision of what it would look like to become the kind of person who's attractive and, and, and spend a lot of your mental energy focusing on what is really good, really beautiful and possible rather than what isn't and all these other things.
Yeah. Yeah. Well said. So the singles that are listening, we're cheering you on. Make the most of the season. This is it's a gift from the Lord. Really? It truly is. And it can be an incredible thing and you will look back if you really honor this season and follow some of the things we're talking about. You will look back on this season with great fondness and it will actually serve your marriage so well.
So, um, so yeah, we're cheering on you singles. We're going to jump into some questions here. Let's go for it. Hey, Jose, what's up, man? Looks like there might be a little bit of a delay here, but I, I think, uh, you're coming through nice and clear now. So, how can we help? What's up? Good, good. Um, I'll read off my, uh, question.
I have it, I have it right here. Um, so yeah, I've been, uh, so I've been dealing with, uh, porn [00:24:00] masturbation for over 25 years. Um, several years ago, I was made aware of the different side effects, specifically around the subject of infertility. And I've tried to quit for good, but my efforts have been unsuccessful.
My wife and I got married about five years ago, and for the past three years, we've been trying to get pregnant. Despite doctors saying that we're both in good health and fertile, uh, we're still struggling. All this added to the fact that we're also not getting any younger, of course. Uh, my question is, how is completely eliminating sexual, uh, misbehavior, porn and masturbation from my life how can that aid in my in our efforts for pregnancy?
And is there any science behind this? That's a great question, man Are there what what other things have you guys done? Like are you I'm sure you have you done any testing yourselves? treatments, anything along those [00:25:00] lines that just be helpful for some extra context here before I jump in. The only thing that we've done, uh, after visiting, uh, the doctors and just making sure that we're in good health to actually get pregnant and, and verifying that we were, uh, that we could get pregnant, uh, was to, uh, start taking, um, just over the corner pills for, uh, fertility.
We've been going on that for several months now, but that's about it. Okay. But biologically, like the tests all came back negative. The doctors didn't find anything. Correct. Yeah. They, they, they, there was a doctor even told us that they were surprised that we weren't pregnant yet. Got it. Got it. Okay. Okay.
That's great. So, uh, that, that's, that's better news than, than anything else for sure. Um, do you guys have any trauma in your histories? Like notable trauma? Um, for my wife's side, I, I feel like there, there has been, but [00:26:00] she, uh, she hasn't really completely opened up about them. Not, uh, I wouldn't say anything sexual, but just, just trauma just growing up.
Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Uh, and on, and on your side? No, no, no, not on my side. Okay. Um, So, uh, I mean, there's a couple of things here. Number one, infertility is, is complicated. There's lots of layers to it and we're by no means medical experts and it is more of a medical issue for sure. Um, but you're asking more about, you know, the role of pornography and masturbation, how they play a role.
So there's two things that, um, that we know from really a very small sample size of research, which is that. Um, especially chronic masturbation, but watching pornography as well, and especially when you do them together can affect your ability to get pregnant. Um, on the male side, specifically, it can lower sperm count and it can affect semen quality.
I'm not super familiar with all the things that they would [00:27:00] typically test a guy for when there's infertility. I have to imagine they would have looked at both of those. For sure, they would have looked at your sperm count. Um, again, sperm, uh, semen quality, I'm sure they would have probably looked at that as well.
So, if the doctors are coming back and saying everything's okay, I don't know that there'd be a biological cause. Um, however, uh, there's some more speculative, um, research. It's I can't even call it research. There's academics who are speculating that sexual misbehavior compulsively, like watching porn and masturbation can actually have a hormonal effect as well.
It can lower testosterone. And, and whatnot. So I think it's possible. We're definitely not people who are like, man, if you have infertility and you're watching porn, just quit porn and you'll start having kids. It's, it's not that simple. And porn is usually one of many things that are probably contributing factors.
Um, so that's why I was asking a little bit around that and the trauma piece. [00:28:00] Um, so I would say, I would say, you know, uh, the first thing is there is a little bit of science behind it and it is quite possible that you will quit pornography. And your fertility will improve. And it could be for the factors I've mentioned, like semen quality or sperm count, but as well, like when you quit pornography properly, it says that you're going through one of our programs.
So when you do this properly and you're really getting to the roots and you're on a journey of development, um, sometimes other things click into place as well as a by product that really assists in this area. So that's the first thing I would mention. The second thing I would say is the trauma piece is, is really important.
And. From a biological perspective, a great level of safety is required, especially on the female side to reproduce. Um, and so much so that if the body for whatever reason perceives that it is not safe, it will, it will actually hit, it'll stop [00:29:00] itself from reproducing because it doesn't want to. You know, God's design of the body, right?
Like the body's not supposed to bring in a child amidst like what are troubling conditions. So that could be at play as well. And that's true on the, it's not to single your wife out. That could be true on the female or the male side of it. Um, and you know, the reality is most of us, we all, we all have traumas to some extent.
So, um, this one's complicated for sure. We're not going to be able to give you just a cut, dry and clear answer, but those are some of my thoughts. Sean, what, what do you think? Yeah, I have literally no experience in this realm. Like, I haven't researched infertility or anything, so I won't go from that angle.
Um, your question is a little bit more specific where I could help more in the area of, you know, what can I do to, uh, heal, eradicate these issues. So, um, he says that you're going through a deep clean to some level. Give me an update on what are you doing with deep clean? Where are you in? Is it the signature course?
Yeah. And then I'd also be curious to know, uh, in terms of your wife and you, like, how often are you guys having [00:30:00] sex? So as far as the program, I am going through the signature course, I believe it is. Uh, I am in month four right now. I have my last call actually tonight. Uh, but it will be looking to extend as coach Matt, I believe.
Yes. Awesome, bro. That's sweet. I'm actually, I want to say I'm somewhere in like eight or nine months now, just being clean of, uh, masturbation. Amazing. Um, that's actually the most I've ever, uh, gone. So it just, it was amazing. Um, our connection for my wife and I has, uh, increased. Uh, dramatically, uh, over the last couple of months, uh, and I want to say it's due to the work we've been doing with DeepClean, um, and as far as sex, um, that area has also picked up, uh, this process, uh, so, [00:31:00] uh, yeah, uh, we, uh, we, for, for some time there was, there was, I'll say.
No action going on for a little bit. Um, uh, my wife went through a hard time during the pandemic and, uh, was depressed, uh, for some time. Uh, but, uh, she's been a little bit, a little getting out of it. Uh, we've been working, uh, together just every day to, to just, uh, better ourselves. And, uh, so as of right now, as of the last couple of weeks, we've been going strong at least three times a week.
Okay, great. So it sounds like you guys are in a much better place to potentially have. Have this happen, right? You guys are increasing the quantity, increasing the quality. My wife is very big into woman's health, looking at tracking the cycle and how you know, what is it? Five days a month you can get pregnant.
So it's not like there's that many days. If you're only having sex once a week, it's not that easy to get [00:32:00] pregnant. So you're increasing quantity, increasing quality. That's amazing, man. I don't think you're that far off. And You're, you're getting professional help. So I just want to encourage you, man. I don't, I don't think there's much I can add other than you're doing all the right things, bro.
So I'll add two more things here, but I would say the scope of this issue is, you know, we were, we're going to do our best with it or we're doing our best with it.
So we had a client go through our program, um, two ish years ago and he basically was like, Hey, my wife and I were ready to start having kids, but this is the one thing, the one area of my life that she wants cleaned up. And he was like, and I want it cleaned up too. Like, I don't want this in my life becoming a father.
So, goes through the program, um, didn't have the best outcome, there's a bunch of life stuff going on and there are other things, didn't have the greatest experience, came back a little bit later, and was like, hey, you know, we're, we're officially trying and whatever, and then they found out they, they couldn't have kids and there was an issue on his end, the doctors found something.
[00:33:00] And, um, and he, he was, it really hit him hard. And so they started going through treatments and, you know, all the stuff that people do when they experienced this. And in the meantime, he came back and did our program again. And he, he was like all in ready to commit. He, um, he did a couple other accessory pieces as well.
Like he really went after it and. I, he got clean and then I'm, I'm trying to get my, I want to get my timeline straight, I'm going to say it was about eight or nine months later, and I was Um, he and his wife decided they were going to do another round of treatments, uh, like IVF and they, um, that she has to do a pregnancy test.
It's just like a precautionary thing. So they do the test and come back. And it turns out that they had just gone pregnant naturally and nothing had really changed. They weren't doing anything different. Um, but, uh, it was a really cool experience. And, um, unfortunately they lost that baby. It didn't survive the pregnancy.
The end. Um, and they were totally devastated. They went through again, a bunch of hardships, um, and about six months [00:34:00] later, and this is why I'm sharing this story. About six months later, the wife, the wife had realized, you know what? I have made such an idol of trying to get pregnant because all of the friends around them were getting pregnant.
Um, you know, they, they really wanted to be around for that stage of life. And she just said, you know what? She had reached a point where she said, God, if I never get pregnant. I'll be happy and you like, just, just let, let go of it. Just took the pressure off and they got pregnant. Like again, like a month later, this pregnancy has been very healthy.
They're due soon. Um, and the one thing I wanted to just encourage you with, man, is sometimes it's the pressure that we put on ourselves. It's same with erectile dysfunction. Like sometimes you've actually healed from what caused it originally, but you have so much inner head trash from the experience, um, and you're putting so much pressure on yourself.
That it actually keeps you stuck in the issue longer than you need to be. So that would be the last thing I'd offer. This is more of the psychological aspect. Cause like I said, the medical parts just beyond us, but if you guys can find ways to just enjoy sex when you're having it and just find ways to not put so much [00:35:00] pressure, be great, uh, uncles and aunts to, to the other babies that are being born in your community and really embrace it.
Um, if you can have that reframe that can go a really long way. Appreciate that. Thank you so much. And it's definitely encouraging to just hear those stories. Yeah, man. Yeah, it happens all the time. And again, like, I don't know if it's because exactly because he quit porn, that some of that stuff happened, but it definitely didn't hurt.
So, um, yeah, you're, you're on the right track. I mean, eight to nine months, you're crushing it. Um, everything's exactly where it's supposed to be. And, um, yeah, we're, uh, we're praying, man. We're going to pray that, uh, that things clear up for you guys really soon. Thank you. All right. Pablo. Hey, man. How you doing? Hey. Nice to meet you. Hi, how can we help you? , I've been dealing with, with spornomasperation for like, 26 plus years, so I had a relapse about like two, three months ago.
Uh, it was just like, I'm going through a lot of stress [00:36:00] so, uh, like I had this, this relapse that was just, it feels like it was just out of stress and I was. Watching porn for for I don't know how long and then I came like right after I came clean to to my wife didn't masturbate, and Since I did and deep clean last year.
It was just like feeling very like Like a very very on a very low low
The, the thing is that, um, well, because of that, she, um, she decided to put like similar to Covenant Eyes app, but much stricter for kids, like on, on all my, my devices. And it's, I actually, like, she came up with that idea and I found that it was great. I started, uh, seeing counselor, [00:37:00] but. I just can't fend off, like, the urge when I'm, like, reading something like news or, Like, I can't trust myself to watch anything online because I feel like anything is, Anything can be racy enough to, to like, have myself consider a relapse.
Yeah, for sure. That's why my question was, is like, what should I consider a relapse? Uh, and, um, so I've been dealing with this, uh, like this disclosure or not, um, because like, It's not like I have watched porn or anything. It's just the, the feeling of, um, of that, that urge I get sometimes like, because of all this stress.
Yeah. Uh, cause of the situation hasn't gotten any better. Um, so you're, so what you're saying is that it sounds like you've had a lot of [00:38:00] progress. How to relapse a couple months ago, but still finding yourself tempted, finding things kind of luring you in. Sometimes it's not even like obvious things.
Sometimes it's like just the news. Like it feels like anywhere you could be tempted. Yeah. Like I, like I, I haven't, I haven't logged into, to Instagram in over a year. Okay. I haven't used any of the, like, I don't use any like, um, boards. Or anything because of that. Okay and like Yeah, what you're looking for is primarily like how to Manage the temptations better.
Is that is that what i'm hearing? Yeah. Maybe. Yeah. But, um, like, yeah, in the end, that's, that's, that, that should be my, my focus. I just get, I think kind of enraged with like, just, uh, being feeling like I'm lured, lured into like temptation though, like by [00:39:00] anything, by anything, I mean, just like even walking in the mall.
Yeah. It's just like that, that thing that it hasn't quit that I thought, you know, that's, that's Okay. I relapsed a year, like within, I don't know, within six or seven months of finishing the, the, um, the course, which actually I need to actually do the reading part, just, just doing the calls for me was, was, um, healing enough.
But, but, um, so I, that's spending on my side, but the thing is that that urge is still, still bothering me. So when I got the email for this. Like, okay, I got to ask. Yeah, for sure, man. It doesn't seem to get any better. Okay. Let, yeah, we're, we're going to help you out for sure. So, um, number one, people do our program, get great results and sometimes relapses do happen afterwards.
If I'm hearing, if I'm hearing it correctly though, um, [00:40:00] which again, this would be typical, it sounds like you've only had one in. A very long period of time. So the very important thing is to keep perspective. And that would be my, my big word to you is perspective. We want to keep this in perspective because it sounds like you've gone in your head a little bit.
Compared to before you did the program again, I don't, I don't know the details of your story. I guess if you did our program, we could pull things up, but, um, but if for you to have like one relapse in the span of a year, um, that sounds like a huge success to me. Um, so I want, I want to keep that perspective.
Now, obviously we want to make sure you get to a place where this doesn't happen again, and that's where Sean and I are going to help you today. But we, we do want to keep it in perspective. I still think you're crushing it despite the relapse that happened a couple of months ago. Um, what you're describing to us sounds like a lot of nervous system dysregulation.
So this is very typical of people who have done the work, but maybe haven't fully gone to the roots. And you, you mentioned that you didn't go through maybe all the material while you were in the program. So that, that could, that could be [00:41:00] part of it. And for people who are listening, who are not in our program, you can get a lot of this material through the book, the last relapse.
We basically took all the program material and condensed it there. So. So people can get their hands on it that way. Um, that, that could go a long way. Cause I'm going to guess that there's probably just some root issues that are remnant a little bit. Um, the one thing that people commonly misbelieve, um, is that once I quit pornography, I won't be tempted again.
And, um, that's not really true. You know, Jesus was tempted in every way. But he was without sin. So the presence of temptations is not necessarily, um, I'm not very alarmed hearing that, um, cause that's going to happen. You know, I, I got tempted yesterday and I haven't watched pornography in eight years, so it, it happens.
Um, but I think learning to regulate your nervous system when it does happen, it sounds like that's a very big missing piece here. Otherwise we're just going to keep trying to tighten the boundaries more and more. Soon it's going to be, you can't even go on a laptop. Um, you know, and then [00:42:00] eventually it's like, well, actually we're not really treating the problem here.
We're, we're just, we're kind of treating the symptoms. Whereas if you can learn how to just regulate your nervous system a little bit better, that could go a really long way. And that's where developing a trigger plan and some of these things can really come into play. Um, I might ask you about that, but I'll give, I'll give Sean a chance.
Cause I can tell he's got some thoughts too. Yeah. So Pablo, thanks for, thanks for laying that out. It sounds like you've definitely had some progress from what I gather. You said you did the calls, but didn't do any of the course. Did I hear that right? I did a bit of the course. I was doing another course at the same time, like an I.
T. course, so it was frying my brains. I bet. Yeah. And it wasn't the group. Was it group calls or one on one calls? I was still with the group calls. Yeah. Okay. So yeah, so it sounds like there's been a limited amount of like, Digging into what's going on here. So that's good to keep in mind.
Stress is really just a blanket word for what you're actually feeling. So that would be just like, when we look at emotions, [00:43:00] like when somebody says stress, I'm always like, okay, well, what are you actually feeling? And they start to tell me, you know, I feel inadequate. I feel overwhelmed. I feel embarrassed.
I feel fill in the blank. Right. And then we begin to actually see what we're feeling, what's going on. I'm afraid of the chaos in the world and I feel out of control. And then we can say, when did that start to become a problem in your life? And we can realize that. We are just out of control and how to deal with our emotions.
So that goes to the nervous system regulation that gives us great things to pray and journal about. But really what it does, it gives us insight into the very root problems of why is that emotion overpowering you? Because like, you know, it was like a month ago, I was checking my DMs on Instagram and someone sent me pornography.
I saw a photo of pornography and it didn't faze me at all. I could laughed at it. I was like. This is insane. Like, so someone would, you know, someone could go and watch porn because of that, but I've regulated. I've understood myself. I see what that is and over [00:44:00] the years of understanding all the ties of even why a naked woman would be arousing.
There's a natural arousal. But why is that objectifying? There's healing there, and that doesn't have to trigger me to the point of like, I don't know what to do with my, I literally had a client five minutes after I saw it. And I felt like it was a great example of how we are to regulate ourselves. And that's an invitation to anybody.
Like I'm, I didn't learn that stuff as a kid and I had to go back and learn skills that I never, ever learned. And, and what I'm saying is you can do it, man. So you're at a really pivotal time right now. Go through the content, man. Stage two, Stage three are going to be really pivotal when it comes to how to regulate your emotions and how to dig up the real problems.
And I think you'll, you'll, you'll be in a different place. If you really take that seriously over the next couple of weeks, I think the month of June would look very different for you. Yeah. Yeah. And for again, for our listeners who maybe don't have access to the course, if you're not one of our clients, that would be chapter three, chapter four of the last relapse, which you guys can get that book.
It's a free PDF at the last [00:45:00] relapse book dot com. Um, so you guys can go through that as well. I think the last thing I would say, and I really want to just drive this home, Pablo, you're doing great. Like you're actually doing a great job, you know, you're Like, um, the amount of listeners we have who would kill to say, I had just one relapse in the last year and a half, like, dude, that's really, really good.
And it's amazing how quickly we can sabotage our success if we don't have the right perspective. So nothing about your situation is like, Oh man, this guy's in crisis, or we need to push the panic button or tighten the technology boundaries. Everything to me says a couple little tweaks, and you're going to be in the clear, like Sean said, you could have a very different month ahead.
Um, if you apply just, just a couple of small things. So, um, we're cheering you on, man. You're, you're doing great and it's only going to get better from here. Thanks. All right, man. Thanks for tuning in. Thank you. And look, if you like this show, make sure you leave a rating or review. Uh, we referenced the book several times today.
Get your copy [00:46:00] of the last relapse at the last relapse book. com. In the meantime, God bless you guys. Thanks for listening. We'll see you soon. [00:47:00]